Judul : Exclusive Interview with Novel Baswedan: Many Revenue Opportunities Are Lost at Customs
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Exclusive Interview with Novel Baswedan: Many Revenue Opportunities Are Lost at Customs
Exclusive Interview with Novel Baswedan: Many Potential Revenue Sources Are Lost at Customs
SOME Some time ago, Police Chief General Listyo Sigit Prabowo formed a Special Task Force (Satgasus) for Optimizing State Revenue. This task force was established to support the work of ministries in increasing state revenue across various sectors.
This Optimalization of State Revenue Task Force is directly led by Herry Muryanto as head and Novel Baswedan as Deputy Head of the Task Force. Previously, both former employees of the Corruption Eradication Commission (KPK) were also part of the Anti-Corruption Task Force. Herry was a former coordinator and supervisor deputy of KPK. Meanwhile, Novel was a former senior investigator of KPK.
In the KPK, Novel is known for his role in exposing various major corruption cases in Indonesia. Including the e-KTP corruption case, Wisma Atlet, and other bribery cases. Not only that, because of his determination in uncovering corruption cases, Novel once suffered an acid attack that injured his face while performing his duties. In addition, he and some former KPK leaders have also experienced bomb threats around their residences.
Then, what exactly is the role of the newly formed State Task Force for Optimizing State Revenue by the Chief of Police, and how is it carried out? What have Novel Baswedan and his team accomplished in this State Task Force? In an exclusive interview with Tribunnews at Palmerah, Jakarta on Thursday (3/7) yesterday, Novel revealed the origin of the State Task Force for Optimizing State Revenue. Here is the full interview:
Tanya (T): What is the history of the establishment of the Satgasus Optimization of State Revenue, and how did you get involved in this Satgasus?
Answer (A): This Special Task Force of the Police was actually established in 2022. At that time, me and my friends "graduated earlier" from KPK with manipulative TWK. But basically, after that, the Chief of Police offered there was a need related to corruption prevention. At that time, we were considered to have the expertise and competence that could be used for such service.
Because the context was the same, at that time my friends (former KPK members) and I, about 40 people, agreed and accepted becoming police civil servants (ASN). Then the Chief of Police directed that this Special Task Force (Satgassus) would directly be under the Chief of Police and be responsible for corruption prevention. People might think that preventing corruption is merely about socialization, but in fact, corruption prevention covers a very broad area. Preventing corruption must involve discussions on regulations, system improvements, and governance. Especially since the Police itself initially did not have any unit working in the field of corruption prevention.
It has been about 2 years, precisely at the end of 2024, that the Corruption Crime Eradication Corps (Kortas Tipidkor) of the Police was formed, which has a Directorate in charge of prevention under the direct guidance of the Chief of Police. In addition, around mid-2024, the Chief of Police had already encouraged us to take part in the field of state revenue. Because indeed, there are many issues in state revenue.
(T): What is the difference with the previous task, prevention and the country's acceptance?
(J): Regarding corruption prevention, our focus is on the deep system. However, regarding state revenue, we focus on how to promote that state revenue, which may not be optimal due to problematic governance, leaks, or other issues that are not optimized in the effort to obtain state revenue. This can be cooperated to be promoted so that it can be improved.
When talking about corruption prevention, we are indeed referring to issues related to good governance, improvement of management personnel, and so on.
(T): So, is this country's recipient broader than prevention?
(J): Prevention is broader than state revenue. One issue of preventing corrupt practices is the constrained or reduced state revenue, more or less like that. If state revenue and corruption prevention are in different sectors. For example, when talking about state revenue, we will see in which areas this revenue comes from? Then which ministries or agencies contribute to or have potential for significant revenue but seem to be underutilized. In this way, we can cooperate and collaborate with the relevant ministries and agencies to optimize it.
(T): Can this Satgassus conduct investigations and interrogations like other law enforcement agencies?
(J): No, no. This Special Task Force has no authority at all. Therefore, in our work, we certainly cooperate with ministries and agencies. That is, if the ministries and agencies are open to cooperation. Because there are also some areas of work that seem not resistant when approached to collaborate, to be helped in optimizing or improving the governance that may not be optimal.
And because we are not given authority, our working pattern is to cooperate with associations or external supervisory parties. Information from the community regarding issues related to state revenue collection could also be possible.
(T): So, what is the form of the work results from Satgassus? Is it a recommendation or something else? And then, to whom is it given?
(J): Because our field is more preventive, towards efforts to prevent and anticipate, what we do is detection. We conduct studies, then take actions and make some recommendations, as well as monitor whether those recommendations are implemented.
The recommendation will be prepared, signed by the Chief of Police, submitted to the leadership of the relevant ministry or institution, and also copied to the President.
It's indeed a problem that the issues we encounter are often not due to one ministry or institution alone facing problems. We often see problems regarding the coordination between ministries and institutions being suboptimal. Therefore, issues related to state revenue become problematic, especially concerning regulatory matters.
(T): Your statement also mentioned Kortas Tipidkor. Then, what is the relationship between Kortas Tipidkor and Satgassus Penerimaan Negara? Is there a correlation?
(J): When talking about country acceptance, it usually involves practices of non-optimal country acceptance, corrupt practices. Corrupt practices are not necessarily corruption. However, corrupt practices can be prevented. And Kortas has a Directorate for Prevention. Therefore, it has not yet reached the stage of corruption.
But in some cases or situations, the corrupt practices have already reached the level of corruption crimes. When such situations occur, we can coordinate with Kortas to urge them to perform their duties and take actions, in this context, the enforcement is investigation and so on. Therefore, in the context of cooperation, we definitely collaborate because the revenue sector is an issue related to state revenue, which is one part of the efforts to prevent corruption, and in certain situations, corruption crimes may be found. Therefore, coordination will certainly take place on a daily basis.
(T): Will the recommendations from Satgassus later be accepted by the Kortas Tipidkor party as a basis for investigating a case?
(J): In principle, when talking about legal regulations, all civil servants who are working and find a crime, must report to the investigator. This is the text of Article 108, Paragraph 3, Law No. 881 concerning the Criminal Procedure Code.
So, when talking about the previous matter, if there is an incident of reporting, it is not only our obligation as Satgasus, but all civil servants when they know about a suspected crime, including corruption crimes, are obliged to report. Therefore, this obligation binds not only other civil servants, but also us.
So don't let it be thought that only we have the obligation. No, all civil servants are required.
(T): Recently, discussions on financial crimes in the field of natural resources and environment, or Green Financial Crime, have emerged. Is there a correlation with Satgassus or not.
(J): Regarding the state revenue in the natural resources sector, there are indeed many potential areas that are not optimal. This applies to both the export sector and taxes. Or some of the non-tax state revenues (PNBP), because if PNBP is managed by the Ministry of Energy and Mineral Resources, perhaps. Therefore, these three sectors could have potential for suboptimal revenue, and problems occur in these three areas.
But regardless of that, the problem might not only be due to poor or suboptimal regulations. It is not only related to a poor system or governance. But there might be malicious intent, there might be crime involved. When this occurs, it is a crime. There are people with malicious intentions who gain benefits by avoiding their obligations to the state, and this is a crime.
So, the sectors are indeed related, there is definitely a connection. Of course, the connection is that taxes fall under the Directorate General of Taxation. However, regarding exports, it is the Directorate General of Customs. As for PNBP, it is most likely related to the Ministry of Energy and Mineral Resources, and the one monitoring or supervising it is the Inspectorate of the Ministry of Finance. These fields, of course, we coordinate.
But for now, we have not yet entered the Directorate General of Customs, because the director general is new. I have not had a chance to talk to him yet. Meanwhile, with the Directorate General of Taxation, the Inspectorate of the Ministry of Finance, and the Ministry of Energy and Mineral Resources, we have already started preparing steps to take actions related to promoting better state revenue.
(T): Has the Satgasus ever examined or researched allegations of fraud related to coal exports? The issue is that PNBP is determined based on the calorific value of the exported coal, but in reality, when it is exported, the calorific value is changed to be smaller.
(J): There have been many studies conducted actually. I think the KPK has already done so. PPATK has also made analyses regarding suspicions, but from the perspective of fund flows. Of course, Itjen of the Ministry of Finance also has some studies on this matter. Therefore, we can collaborate and work together with several ministries to promote the elimination or better removal of these practices, as well as to take action on matters that are still occurring or have already occurred.
(T): In your opinion, regarding determining, "oh this is the degree of its calorific value, for the royalty it is such and such." Actually, who is the Customs or who?
(J): It was the surveyor who did that. There are often manipulations there. I think we have had several discussions from the Ministry of Energy and Mineral Resources in related fields, and we hope that in the future we can gradually promote entry into this area to prevent it by improving governance practices or creating better regulations.
But the practices that have occurred must be pursued, because these are crimes that should not be overlooked. These are serious crimes, certainly.
(T): Are there any investigations regarding the alleged fraud related to coal supply games for Thermal Power Plants (PLTU), resulting in significant state losses?
(J): That's really excessive. It's not just about the price, but also damaging the power plant machines. Plus, the impact of pollution will be even worse. So I have heard, although I don't know the details, as far as I know, there is already an investigation being carried out by the government law enforcement agencies. It seems to be Kortas.
Of course, we hope the process is carried out comprehensively so that the intellectual actors are already identified and the country's losses, the impact of the crime, can be recovered. This is good, according to me, and of course because it is currently under investigation, we don't go into it yet.
(T): Back to the Satgassus function, what is the current work focus being handled?
(J): When we first focused on the fields of energy and food. Although there was a request from the Ministry of Social Affairs for social assistance, we also entered. And there are several related ministries and agencies that we have entered.
Regarding energy, for example, the issue of mining, the assurance of reclamation. This reclamation assurance is managed in a complicated way. Even if you ask who owns the records regarding the reclamation assurance, it is also unclear. Moreover, there are attempts by certain parties to take money that should be used as reclamation assurance, which should be used to cover the open pits not closed by the people who should close them, or by the holders of mining business permits (IUP) who should close them.
There are still other things being done, and certainly, our pattern is more about trying to detect problems, talking to the relevant ministries, then inviting them to collaborate and work together on certain steps. Usually, these steps are not only related to one ministry, as there are still connections and require cooperation with many parties.
Therefore, this state revenue can actually be clustered. First, taxes, second, customs duties, third, PNBP and other revenues.
(T): So, it's three points only? Tax, customs duties, non-tax state revenues?
(J): There are many non-tax revenues. I forgot the total amount, but it is extremely large. Therefore, we tried to cooperate with the Ijen of the Ministry of Finance. Because they are in charge of monitoring. And they have established a work pattern step by step. Now we are entering the sectors of ESDM, KKP, and Transportation. These are also the focuses of Itje from the Ministry of Finance.
And we cooperate with them. In each ministry, we cooperate with the Inspectorate of the Ministry and the Executive Directors. Thus, we can see what the problem is. Then, there are several issues that may exist. We conduct studies to focus on the problems. To be arranged within the context of regulations and governance.
(T): Is it true that Customs has been an institution that is less cooperative towards this Task Force all along?
(J): Indeed, Customs is challenging. Because if we look at it, the lost potential revenue is one of them in Customs, and Customs, imagine, we are not only talking about state revenue, but sovereignty.
There are three things related to Bea, the first one is Cukai. Second, it is related to the state's efforts to restrict. The third is the state's efforts to ban certain goods from entering. If the supervision is not done properly, or if the duties and obligations are not carried out properly, the result is that this sovereignty will not be achieved.
Imagine, when the country concerned maintains domestic productivity. In the food sector, we are talking about farmers, who must be protected when imports enter during harvest. But then, the practice of importing goods cannot or is allowed.
(T): Do you mean illegal goods?
(J): Yes, it's illegal. And that's usually illegal, there are some that are really illegal, and others that are in collusion with the relevant officials. This is the problem. Things like this become problematic, and of course, it's not only in the food sector, but we saw some time ago that our textile industry was destroyed because of this issue. The iron, steel issue.
In Indonesia, there are many textile companies, while in China, there is also a lot of textile production, which they receive incentives from their country. If then, goods from there are allowed to directly compete with domestic production, it will be ruined. Why? Even if they sell at the cost price, they would still make a profit. Why? Because there are incentives.
In Indonesia, if left unchecked, how can we compete or set any price? Not to mention the raw materials, the machines, there are many other factors that will make us lose. The impact is that if we lose, it's not just our business or production that declines, but the problem will be a huge number of layoffs.
So there are many things that then have a tremendous domino effect. Therefore, in my opinion, this needs to be better supervised. Of course, we are grateful that now the Director General of Customs is new. We hope the new director general will bring a new spirit.
We must be cooperative. And we are also present, even if we will be present for some time in the future, certainly in the context of helping and supporting so that the country's interests can be truly implemented in the performance of their duties at the Customs.
(T): What is the last message you want to convey regarding Satgassus?
(J): In the state budget, taxes and customs duties account for about 82.5 percent. And 17.5 percent from non-tax state revenues. Imagine we have such an extraordinary natural resources, there are state-owned enterprises (BUMN), all of them are there in that sector, and we only receive 17 percent. It is very small. Therefore, we must be able to increase it.
Although the facts that occur in taxation and customs also still have much room for improvement, even amidst all the problems. And indeed, it has become a common secret regarding this state revenue that it will certainly face some intervention or conflict with influential people, the powerful ones, you know. But we must be aware that the interests of the country must be fought for.
Because essentially, when we act for the interest of national acceptance, it also includes efforts to combat corruption, then we are considering or taking sides with the interest of the nation, the interest of the broader society.
On the contrary, people who commit corruption, cheat, and do all sorts of bad things are essentially people who are harming themselves. So we should help. How to help? Stop it.
Thus, we will be motivated to work and not need to fear anyone. Because essentially, all those people are the same as us, they are all human beings, and we have the Almighty God. As long as we do things honestly, well, and professionally, we will definitely benefit. Therefore, we need to do it with enthusiasm and continue to improve collaboration and cooperation so that our good efforts can succeed. (tribun network/abd/dod)
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